Guest: Justin Sun (Founder of TRON, Global Advisor of Huobi HTX)
Host: William Joy / Guest Host
This article is compiled from the conversation between Mr. Jin Ming and Justin Sun on the program "Golden Age," reproduced with authorization. The original program was supported by Insta360 as a brand sponsor. For the full conversation and program introduction, please refer to the original program link. (Related reading: Shao Allen in conversation with Justin Sun: How can young people seize the opportunities of the AI era?)
Justin Sun's first in-person, 3.5-hour unreserved conversation in nearly 3 years. It has been exactly two years since their last long conversation in Singapore.
· One is the world's richest person born in the 1990s, who appeared on the Forbes cover with a net worth of $8.5 billion, founder of Tron and "Sun Studies," who paid $4.56 million for a lunch with Buffett, $100 million to buy Trump, and $6 million to buy a banana 🍌—he may be the Chinese entrepreneur of this era who is best at making money and also best at "attracting criticism."
· The other is Jin Ming, the only active national-team world champion athlete among Chinese entrepreneur-investors, China's No. 1 breath-holder at 9 minutes 08 seconds, holder of 59 national records, having broken the world freediving constant-weight record twice, who completed 1 billion yuan in financing including from Alibaba by age 27, and the Chinese IPO shareholder who has held Tesla the longest with a 5,900% return.
· One was born in 1990, the other in 1993. Both are also classmates at Hupan University. Justin Sun is three cohorts senior to Jin Ming but is the only controversial entrepreneur at Hupan to use "MY apprentice."
· This time, after Jin Ming competed in Coinbase's global trading competition in Singapore and won third globally and first in Asia, he held a closed-door recording with Justin Sun lasting 3.5 hours, also the latter's first in-person 1V1 recording in nearly three years.
· By the end of the conversation, what was most striking was not how Justin Sun makes money, but his extreme inner fear:
▪️ The physical body is the ultimate trump card: He can defend against hackers, but what he fears most is "the assets are there, but the body is ruined."
▪️ Cold-blooded top-selling algorithm: Large capital never falls in love with its chips.
▪️ Direct response to the JT controversy: The first review under a real-person camera since it occurred of the public relations calculations and actual response.
· Two people who push to the limit in their respective fields trade moves behind closed doors. In the second episode of "Golden Age," we offer young people of this era no chicken soup—just a clear look at living people.
· The original intention of "Golden Age" is to use society's most extreme cognition to give some inspiration to today's confused young people. Regarding the future, we do not preset any stance; we only light a bit of inspiration. ·
The main text is as follows:
Latest judgment on BTC: AI algorithm evolution and the anti-quantum (QD) crisis
Host: Last time we met, you mentioned that because BTC has miner selling pressure, your personal participation is not as heavy as in DeFi and Ethereum. Two years have passed. Has your view of BTC changed? Are you more bullish on BTC now?
Justin Sun: If you ask me personally, my current thinking is that I am somewhat more bearish. The reason is very simple: the AI algorithm and the QD (quantum computing) problem. I believe BTC will find it very hard to come out of this unscathed. And I think the vast majority of people in the industry underestimate the impact this will have on BTC.
Because BTC is now a relatively mature ETF product. You see BlackRock and many others—large numbers of people who completely do not understand BTC hold large amounts of BTC. They actually do not understand what QD means, so the market is not pricing it reasonably now. Including the discussions these past few days about OpenAI's progress in mathematics—you do not even need to wait for QD. Through classical decryption computation and AI algorithms, within 1 to 1.5 years it may be possible to crack unprotected early wallets or private keys.
A large number of exchange hot wallets today still do not even have basic anti-quantum protection. This is indeed quite dangerous.
The massive selling pressure of 2 million BTC and global cryptographic security
Host: To address this crisis, how do you view the market's and community's defense mechanisms?
Justin Sun: BTC can only help those who are "willing to help themselves." For example, BTC can introduce an anti-quantum address type, and everyone can transfer their money there; but addresses like Satoshi Nakamoto's (about 1 million BTC) or the large number of addresses whose private keys have been lost throughout history (for example, someone lost 5,000 BTC)—no one has the private keys to actively move them.
Once QD or AI decryption arrives, these dormant assets will be breached, and at worst this will cause massive selling pressure of more than 2 million BTC to emerge in the market. Given BTC's extremely high degree of decentralization, it is extremely difficult for the community and miners to reach consensus to freeze, confiscate, or restrict circulation through a hard fork.
Host: Is this only a cryptocurrency problem, or a global problem?
Justin Sun: This is absolutely not just a problem for the crypto world, but a challenge facing the entire internet and financial system. The SSL certificates everyone relies on today to access Google, China Merchants Bank, Bank of America, the New York Stock Exchange, and all equity assets—the mathematical foundation of all of them is built on asymmetric encryption (such as elliptic curve algorithms). This is somewhat like the Y2K crisis we experienced as children—a global cryptographic challenge.
Justin Sun's real positions and response strategy: "Bunker Mode" and a major 80–90% ETH reallocation
Host: Facing this potential crisis, what is your Action Plan? Will you still keep your BTC position?
Justin Sun:
BTC position: Not a single share reduced. We have not reduced our BTC position, because in our positioning BTC is a base position allocation, somewhat like Nvidia in the AI field. Unless we become completely bearish on the entire industry, we will not reduce the base position by a single share.
Activating "Bunker Mode": Our first step was isolation—transferring all involved BTC to new cold wallet addresses that have never signed and never sent out funds. Although this sacrifices interaction and trading liquidity, it ensures security at the algorithm level. Because BTC lacks high-yield DeFi, isolating it in cold wallets causes little loss in yield.
Follow-up operations on BTC: Whether to sell will "wait for the development of the tech community," with the attitude shifting from complete indifference to close attention.
ETH position: Substantially reduced by 80–90%. ETH is an asset for staking yield and DeFi mining. During the last ETH rebound to around $3,600–4,000, judging that it had formed a fragile "double top" structure relying on positives such as ETFs and was at the end of its strength, we cleared 80–90% of the ETH position and have remained in cash since then, shifting into US stocks.
TRON and Huobi project side: TRON and Huobi HTX have already been running anti-quantum algorithms on testnets and are expected to formally deploy on mainnet about one year before the crisis erupts. If an extreme crisis occurs, we will back up data in advance and carry out a "consensus pause," then recover under the security plan.
RMB, US Treasury credit, and the logic of AI hegemony
Host: Do you think the RMB will strengthen or weaken in the future? Is the US Treasury credit crisis underestimated or over-feared?
Justin Sun:
RMB: I believe it will strengthen in the future.
US Treasury credit: The market is over-fearing the US Treasury credit crisis. For assets of the size of US Treasuries, in essence they can be refinanced indefinitely—new debt can always be issued to repay old debt. The core of being able to issue new debt to repay old debt is that the United States maintains global technological and military hegemony.
Humanity's future is moving toward AI, and the key to AI lies in chips, process nodes, and the technology supply chain. Just as Sun Wukong cannot escape the Buddha's palm, as long as the United States continues to maintain ultimate control over the AI supply chain, US Treasuries will not lack buyers.
Views on US stocks and AI crowding: Slightly bearish on the Nasdaq, bullish on AI health management applications
Host: What do you mainly allocate to in US stocks? What do you think of the current crowding into AI assets?
Justin Sun:
Heavily holding US tech stocks such as Nvidia, but in the short to medium term "slightly bearish" on the Nasdaq and AI crowded assets. The risk-free yield on US Treasuries is relatively high, and excessive crowding into general large models and hardware lacks a sense of security.
Old-school assets are all viewed unfavorably; new-school assets are actively embraced. The upper limit for humanity's largest single company will probably not exceed half of US Treasuries, and after the surge in hardware stocks such as Nvidia, upside is limited. Sectors such as storage and optical modules are currently overvalued.
I predict AI investment will diverge, and I am truly bullish on the application side that uses AI in real life. For example, AI health management: from data acquisition and collection points through devices such as the Oura Ring, to data mining, and then AI providing first-hand health decisions supplemented by expert second opinions—this will reshape the healthcare and insurance industries."Sun Studies," Game Theory, and the Establishment of the "Sun Prize" in the AI Era (Texas Hold'em Strategy)
Host: You recently established the "Sun Prize," but you only put out a very small portion of your wealth. Why not, like Nobel did back then, put out most of your estate?
Justin Sun:
It's a bit like playing Texas Hold'em—first look at the cards, first look at the cards. Humanity is entering a new industrial revolution, with AI advancing at the speed of light (it can even produce 50 Nobel Prize-level results in a day), and there is no fixed template for how to establish an award. We first invest a small portion to test the waters, combine LEAN formal verification to achieve machine-automated problem-solving and prize distribution, and then dynamically iterate based on technological evolution.
Sun Studies draws on the ideas of Ayn Rand's The Fountainhead and Wang Xiaobo's The Golden Age. It is a "zero-cost installation system" written for the most ordinary young people in China, helping everyone bootstrap and achieve the transition from 0 to 1. It is essentially a form of game theory that combines the evolution of the era's environment and seeks to maximize individual interests.
What is most lacking right now is understanding and application of AI (as well as love); the ultimate ideal is to perfectly combine AI with existing businesses; use AI to monitor body data and "maximize the value of life with dignity." The recommended reading list is The Fountainhead, The Golden Age, and his own Sun Studies.
TRON On-Chain Ecosystem and RWA (U.S. Stocks/S&P 500 On-Chain) Plan
Host: What is the current logic behind TRON's deposited funds and service fees? What are the future plans in the RWA sector?
Justin Sun:
TRON has become the core transfer infrastructure for global U.S. dollar stablecoins, providing non-U.S. dollar countries with a channel to access U.S. dollar asset allocation. The plan is to bring high-quality U.S. stock assets such as QQQ and S&P 500 onto the TRON chain in November of that year, enabling users in developing countries to easily allocate high-quality U.S. dollar equity assets.
Although TRON transaction fees have risen previously, users can transfer for free through TRX staking, and last year fees were cut by 60%. Users are willing to stay on TRON because they trust network security and the brand premium. In the future, TRON will continue to give back to users by providing value-added services such as U.S. stock RWA.